pgpfan:seip
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pgpfan:seip [2024/09/12 13:14] – Section had nothing to do with MACs. b.walzer | pgpfan:seip [2024/10/10 15:37] (current) – [SEIP for TLS] Consistency. b.walzer | ||
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- | The original IV is replaced with zeros and the IV is shifted down to the first part of the message. Encrypting zeros is a common way to generate a new key from the existing key. For example, the popular [[wp> | + | The original IV is replaced with zeros and the IV is shifted down to the first part of the message. Encrypting zeros is a common way to generate a new key from the existing key. For example, the popular [[wp> |
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This sort of attack is not possible in the case of SEIP. The attacker can get the victim to create a new MDC for them (the MDC is not protected against creation). The secret IV is not encrypted in the same way as the Plaintext (and is thus protected). If the attacker embeds an entire valid message, IV and all, inside the message the victim creates for them, then the IV will eventually get decrypted in a different way than it was encrypted. Alternatively, | This sort of attack is not possible in the case of SEIP. The attacker can get the victim to create a new MDC for them (the MDC is not protected against creation). The secret IV is not encrypted in the same way as the Plaintext (and is thus protected). If the attacker embeds an entire valid message, IV and all, inside the message the victim creates for them, then the IV will eventually get decrypted in a different way than it was encrypted. Alternatively, | ||
- | If the attacker knows the secret IV then they can probably create a new and valid message. So IV disclosure is significant at this level of threat. Still, the situation where the attacker can make the victim encrypt messages for them is fairly unlikely. It seems to me that, overall, SEIP is better than GCM((I acknowledge that GCM is not all that popular in some circles. But what other popular cipher block mode is available right now for use as a counterexample? | + | If the attacker knows the secret IV then they can probably create a new and valid message. So IV disclosure is significant at this level of threat. |
- | The CFB damage amplification is beneficial here as well. If an attacker could somehow come up with an encrypted suffix with appropriately encrypted MDC, splicing that suffix on the end of an existing message to extend it would result in a block of damage. The MDC would pick that block up and fail the modification detection in a way the attacker could not anticipate. | + | If an attacker could somehow come up with an encrypted suffix with appropriately encrypted MDC, splicing that suffix on the end of an existing message to extend it would result in a block of damage. The MDC would pick that block up and fail the modification detection in a way the attacker could not anticipate. So it is very possible that damage amplification could save the day for message creation if an attacker becomes aware of the secret IV. |
====Luck==== | ====Luck==== | ||
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Up to this point we assumed a cipher with 128 bit blocks. The OpenPGP standard supports ciphers with 64 bit blocks. Use of a 64 bit cipher in a SEIP formatted message would result in the secret IV only being 64 bits long. So the strength of the modification detection would be reduced. It's not clear to me that SEIP with 64 bit blocks is something that anyone ever implemented and that such messages/ | Up to this point we assumed a cipher with 128 bit blocks. The OpenPGP standard supports ciphers with 64 bit blocks. Use of a 64 bit cipher in a SEIP formatted message would result in the secret IV only being 64 bits long. So the strength of the modification detection would be reduced. It's not clear to me that SEIP with 64 bit blocks is something that anyone ever implemented and that such messages/ | ||
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+ | A bit of insight from this discussion... The damage amplification of CFB is helpful here but would not have been as helpful if " | ||
[[pgpfan: | [[pgpfan: |
pgpfan/seip.1726146862.txt.gz · Last modified: 2024/09/12 13:14 by b.walzer